result #116369 - ARE UNPUBLICIZED EXECUTIVE ORDERS THE NATURAL EVOLUTION OF DEMOCRACY?

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ARE UNPUBLICIZED EXECUTIVE ORDERS THE NATURAL EVOLUTION OF DEMOCRACY?


[+] serious ballot by Mithrandir
ACTIVE Jul 21,2007 - Sun Jul 20, 08
On July 17, 200, Bush signed an executive order saying that he can freeze the assets of anyone he feels, among other things, undermines efforts to "promote economic reconstruction and political reform in Iraq". Maybe the subtleties of this executive order escape me, but it sounds as if Bush is saying among other things that he can freeze the assets of any american citizen who protests the war and, by extension, who opposes the confiscation and privatization of Iraq's oil resources.

Have you heard about this one? Or did you miss it hidden in the reality TV promotions? Does this give you a warm and fuzzy feeling?

In the latest exchange on the attorney firings, the White House said no one can trump or question Bush's declaration of executive privilege and that it essentially place him and his actions above the law.

Do you think that these executive orders and claims of unquestionable executive privilege are a natural extension of democracy, or do you think they might be something else altogether?

Whatever this is, I don't think its the evolution of democracy 52%
It may very well be the devolution of democracy 31%
Elements of irrationality and/or dictatorship seem to be creeping in slowly 13%
Everything is fine.... 1%
Every good democracy suppresses dissent and places its ruler above the law! 0%

Ballot #116369: has 51 total votes.
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COMMENTS:
Voted : Elements of irrationality and/or dictatorship seem to be creeping in slowly
16 more months of this.

by skylab on Sat Jul 21, 07 11:53am [+]

The first sentence should read: On July 17, 2007, Bush signed....
by Mithrandir on Sat Jul 21, 07 12:03pm [+]

Voted : It may very well be the devolution of democracy
Left unchallenged, it makes a mockery of democracy...this President seems to have set a precedence in excluding himself from the very laws he swore to uphold...in my opinion many of his actions could be construed as undermining democracy...
by thesoothsayer on Sat Jul 21, 07 2:35pm [+]

Voted : Whatever this is, I don't think its the evolution of democracy
I've said this before, and I'll probably end up saying it with my dying breath.

"This is not America."
by Truthseeker013 on Sat Jul 21, 07 2:36pm [+]

Congress can override any executive order. A lot of times the orders are just administrative. Its easier this way than passing whole new laws. There are a number of potentially scary EOs with FAR more significant ramifications - not just the one you mention. FEMA is the perfect example. It basically allows for the imposition of martial law and the elimination of civil rights, congressional oversight, judicial oversight, etc. FEMA was created via executive order by "Mr Freedom" Jimmy Carter - although to be fair every president that has followed him has renewed the executive order. It has NEVER been authorized by law. FEMA combined several other executive orders to create a new organization with frightening powers. These include (but are not limited to) the ability to:
- Take over all modes of transportation and control of highways and seaports.
- Seize and control the communication media.
- Take over all electrical power, gas, petroleum, fuels and minerals.
- Take over all food resources and farms.
- To mobilize civilians into work brigades under government supervision.
- To take over all health, education and welfare functions.
- It designates the Postmaster General to operate a national registration of all persons.
- To take over all airports and aircraft, including commercial aircraft.
- It allows the Housing and Finance Authority to relocate communities, build new housing with public funds, designate areas to be abandoned, and establish new locations for populations.
- It grants authority to the Department of Justice to enforce the plans set out in Executive Orders, to institute industrial support, to establish judicial and legislative liaison, to control all aliens, to operate penal and correctional institutions, and to advise and assist the President.
- It allows the Federal Emergency Preparedness Agency to develop plans to establish control over the mechanisms of production and distribution, of energy sources, wages, salaries, credit and the flow of money in U.S. financial institution in any undefined national emergency.
- It also provides that when a state of emergency is declared by the President, CONGRESS CANNOT REVIEW THE ACTION FOR SIX MONTHS.
- It allows the government to increase domestic intelligence and surveillance of U.S. citizens and would restrict the freedom of movement within the United States and grant the government the RIGHT TO ISOLATE LARGE GRROUPS OF CIVILIANS.

Bet you all didn't know all of this. A bit more scary that the item you mention. BTW, I'm not ken_from_dublin either. I can provide the specific executive order numbers that were combined.

I believe you are missing some of the subtleties in the executive order. It is against the law for a US citizen to interfere in the foreign policy aims of the US government. This can even include organizing a boycott of economic goods from a country with the aim of subverting US foreign policy. More likely illegal actions would be negotiating various deals with the heads of foreign governments that are contrary to US foreign policy and without US government approval.

When taken in context your example may seem somewhat frightening however it barely registers on the fright meter compared to many other EOs and laws.
by TinCan on Sat Jul 21, 07 8:02pm [+]

Voted : It may very well be the devolution of democracy
Democracy can be (and is often allowed to be)
its own worst enemy..
a most unfortunate circumstance.

Democracy will defend its enemies' right -to the death- to destroy it(Democracy)!

Weird(but true?) - I hope not.
There must be a point at which we stop the Politically Correct crap,
and start kickin some ass, in the interests of our own self-protection
by aplmac on Fri Nov 02, 07 7:11am [+]






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