COMMENTS:
comment 2 shoud read "without".
bugger
It's simply a tribute to the power of bullshit.
From past experience, your idea of what constitutes "racist things" and "racist comments" differs markedly from my own.
For instance, Im sure you believe most of Herzogs ballots are racist, right?
Oh, and call me racist, but white people just dont look good in corn rows, full stop.
The most "racist" comments Ive seen lately have come from Cranky, Cathexis, Guy Cabbalero, Beelzlbubba, Steelhamster and yourself.
I still like you more than I used to though 
it all depends on the individual in question -- the one who is viewed as being racist. i think there are some people who are truly racist, in that they hate any race, other than their own and their views are usually driven by fear and belief in false stereotypes of those races. on the other hand, there are some who believe that racism is a universal problem and that it it not just white people who are racist. in other words, that it is a reality that black people can be racist against white people, or asian people and asian people can be racist againt black people, etc.
there are certain people, on this site for example, who forget this fact -- they tend to be the first to accuse a "white user" as being racist/bigoted, but they don't hold the comments made or presented by users or sources of other races, as being racist. (hope that made sense).
i just think that the term racist is over-used and mis-used quite often.
i guess my point is that there is a backlash from some users who have seen a double standard and they want to point that hypocricy out -- their efforts to do so may lead some to believe that they themselves are racist.
good example -- some users on here are quick to make the most absurd and hate-filled comments about christianity (and i don't mean you). but, if someone says something about islam, for example, those same users will go balistic about it. its a double standard. (i know religion is different, but i'm trying to make a point)
i think some hold the opinion in this world that if you are white and christian and a male, you must be a rapist, war-mongerer, hater, bigot.
you ask an excellent question widehead. i don't know the answer. i do know that as for "adoring fans," in some cases, it is possible to like and have a good relationship with someone, even if that person is labled a racist, fairly or not. you can be friends with someone who may have somewhat racist views and still not be a racist yourself.
personally, i think people place far too much importance on skin color, ethnicity and religion -- i could not care less about any of those traits or beliefs.
Whenever I see a ballot about race I always know who's it is without looking.
by Jyl on Wed May 10, 06 3:17am
[+]
Racism has a murky definition.
To some, a racist is anyone who points out the obvious racism of a white neo-con.
A racist is anyone who either A) does not apologize for being white (if they are white) or B) someone who points out that people who happen to be minorities may also have flaws.
By that definition anyone with common sense is a hardcore racist.
Yes.
I find that the majority of racists really have no grasp on what racism is. Thus, when accusation come up, rather than examine their own words and beliefs, they dismiss such accusations as 'political correctness.'
One sign is when they incorrectly generalize to portray racism as 'criticism of any minority, for any reason,' completely missing the key component that the criticism/ attack must have a racial component to be racist.
However, they are still racists.
To some, a racist is anyone who points out the obvious racism of a white neo-con.
by cranky on May 10, 2006 5:59am
why a white neocon? not a black one, or an hispanic one, or an asian one? are only whites neocons? proves what i wrote above. some might say a racist is also someone who brings race up all the time, even when not part of the issue. not saying you do that, not saying you don't. simply saying that a racist could in fact be someone who is, ironically, racist against his own race. not saying you are -- just saying that if you insert the word white, as you did, alongside the work neocon, what message does that convey?
Cath: perhaps that's the technical definition of racism, but it's not the one in play lately.
That's why few people had any problem with Nagins "all you whities get out of my choclate city" speech, but condemned my ballot about the rise in crime relating to katrina refugees as racist (it was compliled in an official report, so I suppose the city of houston is racist too), even though no mention was made of race at all.
Does that seem logical to you? You can point out a fact that does not in anyway concern minorities, and be called a racist, but if you're black you can scream racial epithets till your blue in the face and few people will ever consider even suggesting you're a racist.
For the most part, racists understand that expressing racism in our society is seen as inappropriate. So, these bigots find all manner of twists and turns to both be a racist and have deniability.
On the other hand, I think some of the "racists" you point to here are just too simple to realize how they are exposing their racism.
My grandmother used to make sure we all referred to Blacks as "colored" people, not realizing these was as racist as the "N" word. She apparently failed to notice this, and I think many racists would be shocked to learn how racism is part of their vocabulary.
all people are racist to some degree about some things
no I dont believe herzog is a racist,he just speaks his mind and the truth
David Duke speaks his mind, and what he believes to be the truth, but he's still a racist.
^ as does and as is al sharpton.
herz: I disagree ...
1. I don't see widespread support for racist remarks, even when made by minorities.
2. Nuance is important; the world is rarely as black and white as we might like.
3. I believe it is imperitive that one looks at the relative Power situation when making evaluations.
Is racism limited solely to whites? Of course not! But due to the relative power situations, is this usually the most egregious area when it does occur? I say Yes.
Pointing to a powerless man and decrying his racism, while conveniently remaining silent (or taking positions of support) for the continuance or expansion of privilege for an already priveleged racial group is, IMO, disengenuous, at best.
Jessus Cath..
1)"I don't see widespread support for racist remarks, even when made by minorities"
Watch more television. Particularly MTV base (i.e.e hip hop channel).
2)"Nuance is important; the world is rarely as black and white as we might like"
Agreed, though I think we would differ markedely on who we perceive as the average individual who sees in black and white.
3)"I believe it is imperitive that one looks at the relative Power situation when making evaluations"
Sounds like an excuse for the "oppressed" minorities to be forgiven for racism to me.
4) "Pointing to a powerless man and decrying his racism, while conveniently remaining silent (or taking positions of support) for the continuance or expansion of privilege for an already priveleged racial group is, IMO, disengenuous, at best"
And how often, may I ask, have you taken the position of support for a white person whos suffers at the hand of racists? I cant recall an occasion.
Its your lack of recognition for the instances of racism against white people (or your noticeable absence from ballots where your position would be literally undefendable), that Herzog and others regularly document, that makes YOU the prejudiced one.
When will you realise that for a society to be truly free of prejudice, ALL must be treated with the same individual rights. Their relative racial "position of power" should have NO bearing on the matter.
Yay,another "racist" ballot.
Most people who make charges of racism typically single a particular group for being racist...hmm.
Most people who charge racism typically support the conditions that create and breed it.
Most people who charge racism typically have a pedestrian understanding of anthropology and sociometrics,at best.
Most people who make charges of racism are blissfully ignorant of the statisics for crime,poverty and as such push their dogma down everybody elses throats.Yet most people who complain about racism are typically the same people who bitch about the religeous right and thier dogma.
Liberals and the religeous right(slightly less so),you're all the same.Ignorant to the core.
"The most "racist" comments Ive seen lately have come from Cranky, Cathexis, Guy Cabbalero, Beelzlbubba, Steelhamster and yourself."
"The most "racist" comments Ive seen lately have come from Cranky, Cathexis, Guy Cabbalero, Beelzlbubba, Steelhamster and yourself."
I wont comment on the other users but could you please, please find a racist comment of mine?
I'll be damned if I can find one.
If however I have made a comment that has been misinterpreted as such I will of course apologise instantly for not being clearer.
Unlike some users who cannot or will not defend their obviously racist stance.
"Im sure you believe most of Herzogs ballots are racist, right?"
by lil_ape on May 10, 2006 12:18am
Hmmm, tricky one.
Herzog is a racist. He and his racist fan club can deny it all they want but it's plain for all of us out here who are blessed with the ability to read, process and understand things that he is.
Being the truly evil combination of bigotted and reasonably intelligent herzog is very quick to mask his dreadful views under a shallow pretence of common-sense and seemingly reasonable arguments.
His entire stance, viewpoint and arguments are based on racist beliefs and attitudes - the fact that people can't see that is a tribute to his cunning and a reflection of the guilability and stupidity of the user base here on B&W.
He twists, distorts and misrepresents any intelligent response to his ballots and/or comments by cleverly diverting attention away from the fact he cannot address any points made to him (answering a question with a question is a favourite tatic) and he is a master of setting up ridiculuous arguments based on the either/or fallacy.
Trying to explain this to right-wing, racists is a lost cause though I guess so I will stop for now.
Only for now though....
Some who are not racist might simply be saying racist things to play the devil's advocate, to shake up things just to see who will reply.
Voted : Only "Whitey" can be racist
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