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COMMENTS:
I don't pay taxes yet, but I guess one day I will have to. From everything I've heard and read, it does seem that the very people who can afford to pay more, never want to. I read that Bush had talked about doing away with income tax. Is that true? Would that work? Anyway, I am of the belief that the people with the most money should pay the most and the people with the lesser wealth should pay the lesser :) That seems like a fair system.
Im for a flat tax.
They already do pay their fair share of taxes. What they disagree with is that people don't see that. 35% of $5 million dollars is a lot more than 20% of $20,000, but they get reamed for not wanting to pay even more. As it is they pay more than 80% of the taxes in this country now, so I don't understand the premise of this question.
And, by the way, I'm down toward the $20,000 mark, just so you know where I'm coming from.
Bill Gates.
Ever see that little shack he threw together up in Redmond, Washington? Forty bedrooms, if memory serves. Wireless Internet access in EVERY ROOM, a system that marks EACH visitor with a unique data tag that allows their musical and climatic preferences to FOLLOW them no matter WHERE they may go in the house. Cost of this place is estimated in the fifty-million dollar range. How many people live there full-time? TWO. When anyone can justify WHY Mister Gates felt driven to drop all those ducats on all that space for TWO PEOPLE to live in, THEN I'll rally to the banner of those "poor souls who pay too much tax". Ha.
The rich usually get rich off the backs of those who make $20,000 or less.
The system of making the rich poor more is called...
... Socialism!
Until the citizens of the US realise that it is the only system that works fairly, the people who are at the top and those who support them, will forever be exploiting the people who do all the work, while reaping very few of the rewards.
That should of read 'The rich pay more and the poor pay less'
And how much are his real estate taxes, how much do you think he paid per year in earnings taxes and capital gains taxes? How many people do you think have jobs because he employs them? How many people make money from the stock from his corporation? Why is it that you think he is responsible for people who didn't have his ideas and inventions? Had you even bothered to do research on him, you would find that he gives loads of money to charities and is a very generous person, but I guess none of that means anything, nor the fact that what he pays in taxes per quarter I will not ever see in my life of working.
These selfsame wealthy folks are the ones "outsourcing" jobs, evading taxes, maintaining secret offshore bank accounts, and claiming, all the while, to be Super Patriots.
In fact, when you think about it, what is the conservative agenda mainly about: maintaining or growing wealth and this is accomplished by either keeping the status quo, or moving backwards.
They are not progressive (understatement), and are enemies of any person or party who advocates change and social progress.
Most of us exist in the cracks of the system: The wealthy have to keep the market at least marginally happy -- so that we can buy their goods, support their wars, and vote foolishly for their party, again and again.
Same as it ever was.
Great ballot, mojo.
I agree with you ceejjj
Ceeej. I have to respectfully disagree. They top percentage of wealthy people in this country do not pay 80% of the taxes. There are well over 100 million individual workers in the USA and 80% of the taxes come from the Middle class. As for what the wealthy pay, trust me on this one...they have ways you can't imagine to get out of paying their fair share!! Neighbor's next to my parents summer house have one goat and one chicken and they claim a "farm" subsidy!! Yet...they live in a 5 bedroom very large house with a very large pool and have Mercedes, BMW's and a Porche in their driveway...the poor goat and the poor chicken are relegated to some remote part of thier property...yeah, they're "farmers" all right!! You'd be pissed if you knew how many of them do this and get away with it.
In fact Ceejjj, this one particular neighbor laughs how he pays less in taxes than his handyman. Yes, we have a just system in deed.
Cheating on taxes is Patriotic!
Bill Gates gives hundreds of millions to charity. True, his gifts are subtle advertisements for Microsoft, but so what?
Gates understands that the more everyone prospers the more he prospers.
Cletus, tell me you don't vote. Have you ever had a thought that was made from your own mind? Flat tax, as proposed, would help me but would it help you? Do you know what a flat tax is? For once, be for something that benefits YOU instead of the people that put those ideas in your head Patch--get off the internet and get a job for crying out loud.
can't people pay more taxes than what is due if they want?
Hell No! Rich people don't pay their fair share. There are many tax exemptions and loopholes that only those in the high income brackets can use. They hire the best accountants and lawyers to get every tax break they can and pay as little tax as possible.
Look at all the big corporations that pay little or no tax every year. The whole tax code it written to benefit the rich.
That's is why they are terrified of a Flat Tax or a Value Added Tax like in Europe, where only purchases are taxed.
Since the rich, and coporations buy more they would pay more in taxes.
Yet rich Republicans always profess to be the most Patriotic. Yet they do everything possible to make sure the Government does get a dime from them.
This constant picking on the 'Mexicans' is a little much. Given that it is they who prop up the economy of most of California and Texas.
I wonder if the same rubbish was spoken about the Irish, Polish and other immigrants, when they came to America?
I am guessing they did.
people
No, I shouldn't be forced to pay taxes so that politicians can violate the constitution of my nation and the rights of countless people. If it's a worthwhile program the people will pay for it voluntarily.
My statistics are accurate. Maybe 80 percent of taxpayers are not rich, but the rich that pay taxes pay over 80% of the total dollar amount of taxes. I'm sure there are rich people who get out of paying taxes, however, I know many lower class people who do not pay any taxes and still get money back at the end of the tax year. No matter what the system, there will be people trying to get around it, but to group all rich people in your judgemental tirade is not realistic. If it weren't for wealthy people donating their money voluntarily to charities, there would be a lot of people much worse off. Don't blatantly dismiss the generosity of people like Bill Gates just because it doesn't fit in with your opinion of them.
One other note, not all rich people are conservatives-ie; Teresa Heinz Kerry, and if you'll take notice, the Kerry's charitable contributions were paltry compared to GW and Laura Bush, even though they have considerably more money. Kind of skews the liberals are more generous argument a bit.
Not to offend anyone, but some of you just don't get how the real world works...
Hey Steelhamster, Fuck The Mexicans.
Did you know that the second largest source of income for the country of Mexico is money sent home by Mexicans is the US?
If we kicked all the illegals out, the whole Mexcian economy would collapse.
And if we kicked them all out, Social Security would be fully funded be Americans would have those jobs and be paying the Social Security tax, instead of Mexicans who get paid under the table and pay no tax.
The tax burden on Americans would be less because Americans hired, instead of illegal Mexicans, pay Federal Income, state, local, and property taxes. Illegals pay none.
The only people who benefit from Illegal Mexicans are those that hire them. THEIR PROFITS DOUBLE, while your tax burden increases.
The American Taxpayer gets the SHAFT for every illegal immigrant working in this country.
I say shoot to kill!
So, Ceejjj, you assert that the top of the tax bracket pays 80 percent of the taxes? I'd like your source on this information. It certainly isn't the Internal Revenue Service because their latest stats claim that the top 10 percent of the wealthy in America pay 61 percent of the taxes. This may seem a bit skewed until you realize that these people also monopolize 70 percent of the wealth of the country (i.e., own companies or equity in companies plus lands, homes and other assets).
Let's not debate their percentage of taxes, because there are larger issues here.
First, most wealthy people have accountants and tax attorneys on their team. Personal wealth is whatever they choose. The wealth generated by their ownership, or other equity positions in companies, is almost never taxed. These people pay what they choose on personal income, because their accountant defines that (i.e., do we move this money from an equity account or leave it there?). Now, you're thinking how nice these folks are to pay 61 percent of the taxes when they could probably arrange to pay a lot less, or even nothing, right? Seems so, but it isn't the case. The amounts they pay reflect a much, much lower percentage of gross income than any other tax paying fraction of the general population. And, when you think of it, isn't the percentage of your income that is taxed is the most important factor? Of course it is.
Then there is the volatile question of who produces this wealth for the rich (the rest of us), and who prosecutes wars, and defends their wealth by sacrificing their lives on foreign battlefields?
Well, it goes on and on. My bottom line here is to praise the wealthy for paying a larger amount of money as taxes overlooks so many other factors.
One can point to whatever statistic they want to support this or that point of view. The bottom line is that "those who have the gold make the rules" (by selecting two candidates for us to get excited about, while both of them truly represent only one constituence: the rich).
Do you honestly believe, Ceejjj, that the rich people who select our candidates for every elected office in America are actually going to allow the passage of laws that harm them in any important ways to be passed? If you believe this, I have some oceanfront property in Nevada I'd like to sell you.
Enjoyed your comments. Thanks.
The stats I pulled show top 25% pay 83% total taxes, the top 10% pay 65% and the top 1% pay 35%. The bottom 50% pay 4%. The point you made even makes me feel stronger. Can you imagine what percentage they would pay if they didn't use the legal tax shelters? By the way, legal is the key word there. Who wouldn't use them?
Why do you assume that we process money for the rich when we have the opportunity to do the same? I feel that the rich enable us to earn a living just as much as we are working for them. If there were no rich people, how many less jobs would there be? How would people employed by the wealthy earn a living? I don't understand why you would hold someone at fault for being sucessful.
What is fair? Tax at 40%?
Tax at 50%
Tax at 100%
Why don't poor people have to pay a higher rate because they contribute less, take more and rarely doing anything great for humanity.
HAHAHA THAT'S HILARIOUS!!
:D
I wonder why it's taken a whole week for this question to get 6 votes...? OH BUT THE MIND BOGGLES!!
. I'm gonna be vote seven you simple oinks.
by Jyl on Mon May 09, 05 9:12pm
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(I was laughing at my genius buddy up there^ who cares a lot about all the kids born poor all around him every day, Not at this ballot y'all can't answer.)
by Jyl on Mon May 09, 05 9:18pm
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