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COMMENTS:
*Worded to represent
"B&W enterprises (largest distributer of organic fertilizer and grade A tripe in the country)"
we are getting pretty tired of the steaming turd you been slinging lately too.
by LCD on Wed May 24, 06 10:10am
[+]
^well that sure beats answering the question.
But I notice you haven't banned this ballot yet, that's a big step for you.
herzog: You appear to have a fundamental inability to grasp the concept of what affirmative actio0n is meant to do and in what situations it is applicable, as I note from your hypothetical example and cavalier inclusion of the phrase "... and are not in any way intended to exclude minorities unfairly." (Well, and your snarky attempts at extremist humour, befor ethat, but we'll ignore that for now, to avoid too many variables. 
The question is: Were the hiring practices fair and competitive? You cannot just make teh claim they were and accept that as a premise ... that is the whole point. When you dismiss that question and assume the answer is 'Of course it was all fair and even,' then no wonder you get yourself worked up into a fine froth about the affirmative action!
Here's the problem ... you'd often be wrong in accepting the initial premise.
Is it really likely that only one third of the minority community would be able to do the job? Possible. In some cases, this may be true, especially if specialized knowledge is required. But more likely, for teh average job, the hiring is being influenced by subtle (or not so subtle) biases.
Um yeah cath, in a hypothetical situation as I've lined out I can simply say that and make it stick.
And yes, any deviation from the national demographics is cited as proof of racism, no argument is accepted. For instance, there are fewer female and minority CEOs than there are white males. But more white men try out for the job and have the necessary education to perform such duties. Doesn't matter. Whites and men are overrepresented and so that's all that matters.
Cath: in this scenario, only one third or the minority population is qualified and applies for the job, this leads to the discrepency between the general population and the population of this company. It's a hypothetical situation. I notice you don't have a problem with anyone else setting up a hypothetical situation, why the hypocrisy?
For instance, you did not feel the need to nit-pick counciltuckys very unlikely hypothetical scenario in ballot 94720, you simply answered the question. Try that here.
Duke must be B&W's largest customer. Either that, or he works there and is their number one shoveler.
whatever herzog says, i support. more kool aid. i need the kool aid. give me the kool aid.
funny enough, the cult of herzog is growing daily. join us or perish!
herz: As usual, IMO, you overreact, oversimplify, and generalize.
Having a disparity between percentage minority in the company and in the demographic is not 'proof' of racism. Nor has this ever been alleged by any serious source -- it is another exaggeration that is used to whine about affirmative action.
Now, it MAY be indiciative of the possibility.
IF only 1/3rd of the minority population is qualified and applied (and was able to apply), and that entire segment was hired, then OF COURSE that indicates there is no hiring problem based on race.
The problem is, you put these qualifiers into your scenario when these are exactly the questions that are in question in real life situations.
And then you sit back expecting people to draw parallels between your unrealistically premised 'hypothetical situation' and real life.
Sorry, I do have a problem with these kinds of excersizes -- I do not find them intellectually honest. You take a situation, add qualifiers that do not exist in real life, and then present it in such a way as to make implications on the braod issue.
Tsk ... you used to be better than this. A few years ago.
Kev:
Would you be offended if I offered you some lemonade?
Duke's next ballot:
If a Cadillac full of black people was headed from New Orleans to Houston at 95 miles per hour, and a Buick Century with four white people was headed to Houston from Dallas at a sensible 65 miles per hours, how many of the black people in the Cadillac would would be on welfare or receiving affirmative action?
For extra credit: How many of the black people would try to panhandle or mug the white people once both cars reached Dallas?
Kev:
Would you be offended if I offered you some lemonade?
by cranky on May 24, 2006 1:33pm
kinky. little devil. nah, not into watersports. regardless. its herzog's kool aid that his followers crave. our master, errr, i mean herzog is so generous with the kool aid. i have to go because in 2 minutes, herzog will beam his message to all of his followers and i don't want to miss a word.
The payroll should represent the qualified applicants but no one should force them to change their hiring practices if it doesn't.
Of cranky, LCD, and cathexis not a one managed a coherent response. All managed to get in a shot at me of course.
Surprising? Not really, I don't think I've had a straight answer from either of the three stooges any time in recent history. Irritating? Again, not really, I've come to accept their personal attacks and attempts to derail my ballots.
But it would be nice if every now and then a real user would show up to comment. A simple I agree or I disagree, something that comes near addressing the actual question posed, rather than attacking me, the way the ballot is phrased (which is tolerated when anyone else does it, it's a ridiculous double standard), attacking texas, bush, or whatever.
Just once. My birthday is comming up soon, maybe that can be a gift: a straight answer to one of my questions.
Praise allah, wise and merciful! Thc managed to sneak in a real answer while I was typing. This is a glorious day indeed!
Free tripe for everyone!
Just once. My birthday is comming up soon, maybe that can be a gift: a straight answer to one of my questions.
by herzog on May 24, 2006 4:08pm
you will all obey. it is herzog's birthday soon and it should be a national day of celebration and rejoicing. kneel cranky and assume the position. the position of devotion to the wise herzog. the rewards are beyond your wildets dreams.
Quick, quick! Give me some Kool-Aid!
Cathexis- you seem to work your logic on the basis that white employers are all racists? A foolish assumption isn't it?
"You take a situation, add qualifiers that do not exist in real life, and then present it in such a way as to make implications on the braod issue."
- it's as if you are indicating that you think all employers are racist in their decision making if it were not for affirmative action?
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